Non-Ascendant Mindset, No Doubt

[hollis]

I have given prayerful consideration to this thought for some time and would like to express it:

What if I don't want to leave Earth? If everything you say is true, and the Rapture is imminent (like your two-minute warning scenario), what if I don't want to go? It sounds like pure selfishness now that I am putting it into writing, but I am perfectly happy to love God as a mortal. I am perfectly happy to live with my wife and my dog, working my job helping soldiers with psychological problems, going to Mass, and beginning to raise a family. Do I have a choice in this? Or will the majesty of God be so great that when the time comes I won't care about my mortal life anymore? Is this the sign of non-ascendant selfishness? Or just mortality expressing itself?

[Caligastia Lanonandek]

Ascendancy and Non Ascendancy are both choices pursuant to your own freewill.

However, when one rises you will also achieve a clarity of thought and purpose and see the scope of the bigger picture - not to mention you're going to feel pretty good about things.
If one wanted to come back - it would be discouraged. Even so, if you were dead set on it - you could. Yet, the question arises - why would you want to?

Most people say, well - I'd like to help my wife or my kids or..................

The bare truth of the matter here is simple. If you could have done these things - they already would have been done and your input is meaningless. For these things, the Advens have been given. Father and The Almighty are here. Father has sent His finest and best to tend to these issues and nothing you could do would begin to equal their offerings. Take your just deserts - you will have earned them

[hollis]

I suppose I wouldn't want to come back to a ravaged planet where non-ascendants have been rounded up and put into southern Colorado. When I think of it that way, then no, I would choose not to come home.

Also, I have faith in my wife that if anyone is ascendant, it is her. Thinking forward, if I were to ascend with the mindset that I have now, I would feel regretful that I did not live this life to its end. However, that is my assumption of the future and it could be very wrong.

Which then brings me to a second question: if I am not to live this life to my natural death like I have so many others, will I become aware of the memories of growing to old age from previous lifetimes so that I may have that experience?

[Caligastia Lanonandek]

You'll receive all of your collective memory back. You'll know everything that is contained within the resevoir of your own soul.

Also, you'll gain an appreciation for what true joy feels like.

[hollis]

That is comforting. As bizarre as it sounds, I was born to be an old man. My parents always said it. And to think that I would never live to that or experience old age is troubling, in fact just as troubling as I felt about dying in the war. So to know that I will have the memory of old age, though not necessarily old age with my wife, is comfort.

[david]

Quote from Cal
You'll receive all of your collective memory back. You'll know everything that is contained within the resevoir of your own soul.

Is the recall of traumatic memories going to be a problem? It seems there is a potential for 500000 years worth of deaths to recall as well as who know what. Would it be safe or correct to have some memories reduced or is it best to remember the whole lot? I am just thinking that a full recall might be too much to handle for some folks.

Regards
David

[Caligastia Lanonandek]

DH

The soul is very protective. I wouldn't worry about it.

[hollis]

The pastor of my parish had a sermon today related to the Annunciation. The take-away from it that I had is that God asks something of everyone, whether they like it or not. They may be selfish and say no, as many have in history, or they may be selfless, recognize the glory of God, and say yes, as Mary did. The more I contemplated it, the more I hope that when the time comes that God asks something of me, I say yes as strongly as Matthew records Mary saying it.

[Caligastia Lanonandek]

I'm not sure I agree totally with your pastor. Take a different subjet for perspective - sacrifice.

The idea of sacrifice is that YOU have
control of God's actions by 'sacrificing' something to Him and He'll make a deal with you in return.

Jesus SACRIFICED himself for our sins. Yet, were that true, you'd have no need to stand judgement now would you.

Father asks only that you be good people. To those further along the path - he might inspire someone (as he did with meter reader in Florida). They then can say yes or no (freewill).

It always has annoyed me that people say that Father is all loving and merciful then in the next breath rationalize a vengeful and mean spirit as being 'all just'. No one can be frightened to Father. They can, however, be frightened to the collection plate and one must always be mindful that religion is also a business.

Odd isn't it that Jesus didn't go into business? You'd think that those who follow his example would actually FOLLOW HIS EXAMPLE. We're having a special on miracles today, a 2fer, two for the price of one. Raise the dead, feed the hoards, bring your favorite leper..... Miracles R Us (contact Judas for more information) 1-800-MIRACLES

[maddoctord]

Non-profit organizations stay in business through the donations of others. This isn't to say that they are wrong for asking; society expects its pay as well as the staff of that organization. The majority of the intentions of non-profit organizations is to provide a service to others without much incentive other than doing well for others.

There are many however, that use it as a charade. It's always good to know who it is you trust.

[Caligastia Lanonandek]

In Canon City - there are many temples of worship but there is only one 'church', a place called Loaves and Fishes. they give food and clothing to the poor during the year and at christmas collect toys for kids. Last Christmas I volunteered time hand sorting food for distribution, this year I provided a really nice bike for some kid and I'm not alone. The # of toys collected is impressive. There's no demand for worship or religion. Just a collection of good people doing good things for those in need.

Conversely, many religious organzations do great charitable works. Typically though, you have to go through the temple to get to the church. Then with other churches, they only provide for their own membership and only as a quid pro quo for their temple participations.

[hollis]

It is very late and I will only give Cal's thoughts the time: I do not think that my pastor was talking about an "exchange" with God. I think that he was talking about acceptance of God's will, without regard to the "return" the exchange would yield. I think that he was saying that there are some times that God says "you will" or "you won't" and whether you do or you don't says a lot about the person that you are.

As a side thought related to your post about whether Christ sacrificed himself instead of me: I have never been a believer in "substitutional" Christianity. Catholics (and I) believe that whatever forgiveness may be received from Christ was instituted the night before at the Last Supper. Christ (according to my Catholic faith) died upon the cross to show me how I must live my life. His death was not a substitution for my death, nor was it a complete absolution of my sins. It was the finest example that leadership has to offer. It was leading by example. Christ showed upon the cross that to lead was to suffer selflessly in place of another.

More tomorrow.

[Caligastia Lanonandek]

Hollis

In my experience with Father he has never said 'you will'. He always 'asks'. Then you will or you won't. He never commands. Now when he does ask (me), I take it as a command - but that also is my choice.

As to your take on sacrifice, I think you got it right. Jesus was the example of his teachings and his faith. However, you're quite wrong about the Catholic take on it and I once had extended discussions with one of their theologians on the point. They are hell bent on the idea that Jesus sacrificed himself for our sins.
So much so they ignore or 'reinterpret' to come up with their own desired wishes.

In Isaiah it is clearly stated that 'The Lord' hateth animal sacrifice.
It doesn't say which Lord but I view Isaiah as the Book of Immanuel. Regardless, those of the Trinity will have the same or similar mindsets. It follows that Jesus also detested the practice.
Then they turn around and say he died for our sins but they also admit that we must stand judgement. If we've already been saved because Jesus BOUGHT us out - there's no need for judgement and the fallacy of the arguement is obvious. Aside from ignoring Isaiah, they also ignore the incident with the moneychangers which were the first step in the sacrifice business the priests had going at the temple. They also ignore the fact that he could be motivated to violence.

If there was any truth to the proposition, it would follow that my wings are forever dipped in human blood. Such is not the case.

[hollis]

Let me change my wording on sacrifice in terms of the Catholic church: It is MY belief that transactional Christianity is a fallacy. And I will clarify that many evangelical protestants place the transaction at the crucifixion, whereas most Catholics place the transaction at the Last Supper. If I had to choose one, I would choose the latter (more than likely because that is how I was raised). I choose the last one, and I choose to celebrate the last one, because it still evokes the "leadership by example" model. I cannot, in my daily life, lead by example through crucifying myself. I can, however, lead by example through taking the Eucharist and attempting in my small way to understand its mystery. I have only ever "understood" it once, and that moment of understanding brought me closer to God than anything.

I understand your quoting of Isaiah. I will go out on a moral relativism limb and say that the sacrifice the Jews were making at the time was equivalent to their evolutionary moment. Just as I will go out onto the same limb and say that the Church's views on the Eucharist are on par with the Church's evolutionary moment.

And lastly, I completely agree with your assessment of God's requests. He asks, but as a subordinate to the Father, one must politely understand that a request from God is a damn order. With all orders there is a choice to follow it, but you consider the source...

And thank you for giving this line of thought some thinking. I have been troubled by it for about six months.

[Caligastia Lanonandek]

I understand your quoting of Isaiah. I will go out on a moral relativism limb and say that the sacrifice the Jews were making at the time was equivalent to their evolutionary moment. Just as I will go out onto the same limb and say that the Church's views on the Eucharist are on par with the Church's evolutionary moment.

I'd go yes and no on this. When Jews first began the general mindset of things involved animal sacrifice. A primitive state of affairs. In 500 BC Isaiah put them on notice to knock it off. They didn't until some time later.

The Catholic Church, on the other hand, is a slave to the interpretations of men and have frequently ignored the Bible (the source for their beliefs) to accomodate and validate these erroneous interpretations. It begs the question of who they are worshipping, God or man.

And lastly, I completely agree with your assessment of God's requests. He asks, but as a subordinate to the Father, one must politely understand that a request from God is a damn order. With all orders there is a choice to follow it, but you consider the source...

Lucifer wouldn't disagree with this assessment, he feels the same way. I don't. I serve because I want to and for no other reason. Father is the only one I will obey without question.

I will give you the 'secret' of the Eucharist - the one religion didn't get because they were focused on sacrifice.

Jesus attempted to show how we could connect with the Holy Spirit 5d - aka The Christ spirit. The was not delivering a ritual saying 'eat me'.

In my youth, I served mass for a number of priests. Only one understood the import. During mass, when he did the invocations at the consecration, those summoned actually arrived and you could take note of the fact when the hair on the back of your neck stood at attention. For other priests, this was a mindless by rote ritual.

Jesus bestowed the Holy Spirit upon the Apostles. Everyone else has to work to get there. Those who succeed are frequently called saints because the develop dimensional abilities they didn't previously have. For instance, Padre Pio could bilocate. St John Borromeo used to fly around the inside of the church. It is also true that post mortem, their bodies do not corrupt because they are still connected to 5d.

Jesus's idea of the eucharist was to give you a methodology for opening a door that leads to 5d. It was a DIMENSIONAL technique intended to help you in the journey. Had the church not taken a wrong interpretative turn, their priests would KNOW how to function in spirit and would be able to teach others. Buddhist monks are taught. There's no reason priests couldn't have learned this also.