Obama The 'secret schizoid'

[Adam]

The problem with Obama is that he does not answer the questions (in a truthful manner) asked by the electorate in regard to his subjective experiences in his life. I think Obama is only playing a part and is a cold individual. Thus a danger.

The 'secret schizoid'

According to Ralph Klein[23] there are many fundamentally schizoid individuals who present with an engaging, interactive personality style which contradicts the timidity, reluctance, or avoidance of the external world and interpersonal relationships as emphasized by the DSM-IV and ICD-10 definitions of the schizoid personality. Klein classifies these individuals as secret schizoids[23] who present themselves as socially available, interested, engaged, and involved in interacting in the eyes of the observer, while at the same time, he or she is apart, emotionally withdrawn, and sequestered in a safe place in his or her own internal world. So, while withdrawnness or detachment from the outer world is a characteristic feature of schizoid pathology, it is sometimes overt and sometimes covert. While it is overt it matches the usual description of the schizoid personality offered in the DSM-IV. According to Klein, though, it is "just as often" a covert, hidden internal state of the patient in which what meets the objective eye may not be what is present in the subjective, internal world of the patient. Klein therefore cautions that one should not miss identifying the schizoid patient because one cannot see the patient’s withdrawnness through the patient’s defensive, compensatory, engaging interaction with external reality. Klein suggests that one need only ask the patient what his or her subjective experience is in order to detect the presence of the schizoid refusal of emotional intimacy.[23] Descriptions of the schizoid personality as hidden behind an outward appearance of emotional engagement have long been recognized, beginning with Fairbairn's (1940) description of 'schizoid exhibitionism' in which he remarked that the schizoid individual is able to express quite a lot of feeling and to make what appear to be impressive social contacts but in reality giving nothing and losing nothing, because since he is only playing a part his own personality is not involved. According to Fairbairn, the person "...disowns the part which he is playing and thus the schizoid individual seeks to preserve his own personality intact and immune from compromise."[24] Further references to the secret schizoid come from Masud Khan,[25] Jeffrey Seinfeld,[26] and Philip Manfield,[27] who gives a palpable description of an SPD individual who actually "enjoys" regular public speaking engagements, but experiences great difficulty in the breaks when audience members would attempt to engage him emotionally.[28] These references expose the problems involved in relying singularly on outer observable behavior for assessing the presence of personality disorders in certain individuals.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizoid_personality_disorder

[hollis]

David,

My background in college and in the army was in psychology. While I agree on the surface that Obama could meet the DSM criteria, no respectable diagnosis of a psychiatric condition can be done at a distance. Folks tried this one on GW Bush, but the at a distance psychiatrists ended up looking foolish. People thought Bush had autism, or oppositional-defiant disorder, or deep problems with his Mommy and Daddy. None of those got traction.

My point is that diagnosis requires close interaction with a patient to determine whether or not they meet four or more of the DSM-IV-TR criteria listed below:

1. neither desires nor enjoys close relationships, including being part of a family
2. almost always chooses solitary activities
3. has little, if any, interest in having sexual experiences with another person
4. takes pleasure in few, if any, activities
5. lacks close friends or confidants other than first-degree relatives
6. appears indifferent to the praise or criticism of others
7. shows emotional coldness, detachment, or flattened affectivity

[Caligastia Lanonandek]

Obama has the fixings for a dictator of the worst kind. He was caught with his disingenous tripe last night, and today has been called a liar by Acron. Joe the plumber nailed it right.

[Adam]

Well Hollis, the difference between a diagnosis and an analysis are written in the common language of wikipedia. I seriously doubt that the governments of the world refuse to do a respectable diagnosis of a psychiatric condition at a distance because you were trained that way. Also my opinion does not elevate to a diagnosis nor an analytical review. Which I assume gives the narrow minded a moment of pause. Anyone can engage in analysis. Diagnosis requires training. Opinion requires a thought.

1.)Diagnosis is the identification, by process of elimination, of the nature of anything. Diagnosis is used in many disciplines: medicine, science, engineering, business, and many trades.


2.)Analysis
Linguistics began with the analysis of Sanskrit; today it looks at individual languages and language in general. It breaks language down and analyses its component parts: theory, sounds and their meaning, utterance usage, word origins, the history of words, the meaning of words and word combinations, sentence construction, basic construction beyond the sentence level, stylistics, and conversation. It examines the above using statistics and modeling, and semantics. It analyses language in context of anthropology, biology, evolution, geography, history, neurology, psychology, and sociology. It also takes the applied approach, looking at individual language development and clinical issues.

[Caligastia Lanonandek]

Guys - I think you're both right. Hollis is correct that a remote diagnosis is very bad psychiatric procedure. Dave is right with regards to opinion.

My opinion is that Obama is a narcissist and we were to believe him - they took the toliets out of his place a long time ago

[Adam]

"Folks tried this one on GW Bush, but the at a distance psychiatrists ended up looking foolish. People thought Bush had autism, or oppositional-defiant disorder, or deep problems with his Mommy and Daddy. None of those got traction".

"Hollis is correct that a remote diagnosis is very bad psychiatric procedure".


While I agree with both comments. I think the poor procedure continues.

[hollis]

David,

My mistake. I took your posting to mean you were proffering a diagnosis, rather than an analysis. I do know the difference between the two, but I mistook which one you were suggesting.

I seriously doubt that the governments of the world refuse to do a respectable diagnosis of a psychiatric condition at a distance because you were trained that way.

I am unsure what this comment means, though.

[Caligastia Lanonandek]

Every government creates psychological profiles on other leaders, generals etc under the theory of know thy enemy. The Germans did so with Patton, Ike, Bradley and others and adjusted their tactics to match their opinions (whenever it was possible).

[Adam]

My mistake. I took your posting to mean you were proffering a diagnosis, rather than an analysis. I do know the difference between the two, but I mistook which one you were suggesting.

Hollis for clarification I was stating my opinion. I understand that you know the difference.

I seriously doubt that the governments of the world refuse to do a respectable diagnosis of a psychiatric condition at a distance because you were trained that way.

I am unsure what this comment means, though.

The comment was stated poorly. What I meant to say was: Just because you are ethical does not mean that other are. As you well know, before you received your commission as an officer you had to pass psychiatric analysis.

How many of the people who have majored or minored in psychologies in the past 30 years have went on to serve in the private and government sectors? Lets just say allot. Take advertisement of products as a point to reference. County and state government have psychiatrists on staff.

Social workers have compiled the data. Data processors did their work and government think tanks do their work.

The FBI agent at ruby ridge - who took the shot....underwent psychiatric analysis.

While I don't have the empirical evidence, my opinion is that psychological analysis is prevalent in the society. For good and for ill.

[hollis]

Now that I understand the point about world governments doing psychiatric analysis, I can put forth an interesting fact: we do them too, and they are usually wrong.

Two cases in point from Iraq: Saddam Hussein and Muqtada al-Sadr. It was thought, based on the CIA's best shrinks, that Hussein would put up a "valiant" (meaning fake) fight for the cameras of his country with the Republican Guard. Then, after the regular Iraqi Army units were defeated and all that was left was the Republican Guard, he would valiantly fall on his sword and surrender to the United States while doing no actual fighting himself. Thus spurring a civilian uprising against the US. While the uprising happened, the valiant fight did not. Hussein chose to hid in a hole for 8 1/2 months surrounded by dirt and a whole lot of American money, praying he'd make it out of the country.

Muqtada al-Sadr was considered by most to be borderline retarded, or Autistic, and at the time that his star was rising, no one took him seriously. The intelligence community believed his perceived mental limitations would prevent him from running the Mahdi Army. They were wrong again.

[Caligastia Lanonandek]

The MMPI Minnesota Multiphasic Personality Inventory, while not perfect, does provide some valid insights.

In my own case, I show as within normal limits EXCEPT that I'm slightly grandiose in that I believe I can do things other people can't. The anaylsis is essentially correct except that I believe what I do because I CAN do things other people can't and have plenty of evidence to support the belief.

Regardless, the anaylsis is correct.

As I see Obama, he is a little man with a great deal of fear. Combine this with a narcissistic bent that tops out with his Messiah presentations and his belief that most people are essentially stupid and you have the same personality profile as Adolph Hitler. Add also his bigotries against whites (which have enabled him to get as far as he has with a primarily black voting base) and you the fixings (analagous to Hitler's bias against Jews) for some serious problems.

One of Hitler's first steps was to disarm the country and came up with gun controls. Not ironically, Obama is on record as being against the 2nd amendment.

If one need to know where this can go - you only have to look back at history. There are many such examples.

Hitler also believed he was divine and created a religion for his worship. Obama Obama Obama Obama...................................

There are many comparitives here that apply but the bulk of people choose to believe that 'it can't happen here'. Most Jews would disagree.

[Adam]

Hollis your expertise is duly noted and thank you. Combined with Cals statements on valid insights and correct analysis (again thank you). It seems to be a Mexican stand off. With the risk factored in for not doing them. I can see were analysts are given the green light.